First of all, this is NOT against ANY janitor/mod/admin/webmaster/whateverrankyoucanimagine.

I'm feeling some arbitrariety (or at least, not being clear what is exactly okay and what isn't) with the "no-young" rule.

I've saw some posts deleted with dubious arguments, and I've saw some posts with clear young AND explicit content such as post #9569, which was even approved (and even it's tagged as "young"...)

I'm asking for clear rules about what is permitted and what isn't, i'm not saying you should delete post #9569 and not delete my post of a male elephant which looks young for some people, and the background slightly resembles a cradle (i even added a takedown request for that image, so it's not a big deal if it got removed.)

It's more like a request for a clearer rule for avoiding future incidents on this.

EDIT: I'm not complaining against the rule either. I've read this post and even there they fail to explain what is OK and what's not. Just to be clear, i'm asking for clearer rules.

EDIT2: Double checked above post. About last message of Lance Armstrong on this post, that line was clearly crossed on some posts, so a clarification on these rules are really important.

Tending to agree, posted a doe with udder and teats which is an adult deer trait, nothing besides spots to indicate youth, but the prompt contained the word young (used to avoid breasts - trying for anatomically correct). Deleted as young. No reply from admin when I asked for clarification.

fuzzybunny23 said:
Tending to agree, posted a doe with udder and teats which is an adult deer trait, nothing besides spots to indicate youth, but the prompt contained the word young (used to avoid breasts - trying for anatomically correct). Deleted as young. No reply from admin when I asked for clarification.

You can try "flat-chested" and the like. "Breasts" in the negatives work too.

I've had cub content removed being told it's not allowed but it seems to be

Why are there different standards for e621 and e6ai in the first place? I'd genuinely like to know. Something about AI ethics?...

Are teenagers "young"?

Is this no-young policy supposed to be final now? Can't say that I understand. *Everything* else is allowed here, even furries eating feces freshly tapped from the anus - one of the many things here I wish I could unsee...

If it's all within the law, then who are you to decide that fecal snacking is fine and some casually nude 12 year old furry is not? I don't think anyone really understands your point about models potentially being trained on actual CP, which is of course a no-go, but also rather far-fetched.
Why can't you apply the same standards as on e621?

I don't get any kicks out of any form of abuse, ficticious or not. I just want to have some young, furry, innocent same-age romance or casual nudity in the mix - not defenseless cubs getting used like things and not *too* young either (double-digit minimum).
It's just as legal as displaying furries literally eating shit. The difference is that the one is very cute and dignified, while the other is disgusting and disturbing.

If you suddenly developed moral concerns and want to apply censorship, why don't you ban abuse instead?

furlover69 said:
Is this no-young policy supposed to be final now? Can't say that I understand. *Everything* else is allowed here, even furries eating feces freshly tapped from the anus - one of the many things here I wish I could unsee...

If it's all within the law, then who are you to decide that fecal snacking is fine and some casually nude 12 year old furry is not? I don't think anyone really understands your point about models potentially being trained on actual CP, which is of course a no-go, but also rather far-fetched.
Why can't you apply the same standards as on e621?

I don't get any kicks out of any form of abuse, ficticious or not. I just want to have some young, furry, innocent same-age romance or casual nudity in the mix - not defenseless cubs getting used like things and not *too* young either (double-digit minimum).
It's just as legal as displaying furries literally eating shit. The difference is that the one is very cute and dignified, while the other is disgusting and disturbing.

If you suddenly developed moral concerns and want to apply censorship, why don't you ban abuse instead?

The E6AI Admins do not give this site as much attention as their main site E621. If you really want to engage them in discussion about this topic, you may want to try their discord for E621. The Approvers can only follow the rules as laid out, it is not their say.

It seems clear to me: https://e6ai.net/wiki_pages/4
No:
Underage Characters: Any submissions containing underage characters in explicit situations
Visual appearance or canonical age both count for this

It's just a question of enforcement?

Can anyone explain why this post made it through and was approved if this content isn't allowed? https://e6ai.net/posts/18770

A mod literally looked at this pic, looked at the added prompt, which indicated that they used practically every cub related tag, and was like "Yep, that's fine."

I too think it's weird that e621 is practically a place where anything goes, and people can't post the kind of content they want here. The majority of the posts taken down are because of cub related art reasons, clearly that's what they want. I just don't understand how the one link I posted made it through if it's such a "strict" rule.

firemetal said:
Can anyone explain why this post made it through and was approved if this content isn't allowed? https://e6ai.net/posts/18770

A mod literally looked at this pic, looked at the added prompt, which indicated that they used practically every cub related tag, and was like "Yep, that's fine."

I too think it's weird that e621 is practically a place where anything goes, and people can't post the kind of content they want here. The majority of the posts taken down are because of cub related art reasons, clearly that's what they want. I just don't understand how the one link I posted made it through if it's such a "strict" rule.

Like hell I looked at the prompt. It slipped in.

You got it deleted, pat yourself on the back.

Lance Armstrong It seems contradictory that the tags "cub" (141 results), "young" (267 results) are populated at all. Some of them were approved by yourself, most recent being this upload from 27 days ago, and there are more preceding images approved by several different admins/janitors.

This makes the goal of the policy unclear. Would these not warrant auto-deletion upon upload if they are marked with the cub/young tags by the director at the time of publishing? From the wording of the policy, the results for both of these tags should read (0).

I do not mean this as a personal knock. I understand that policy and enforcement are difficult and there are behind-the-scenes discussions over these things. I'm just confused about this discrepancy and I am curious where the line is drawn.

EDIT: As of 21 March, Dasadevil has flagged the linked upload above. I am concerned that there may be serious moderator disagreements in terms of policy & enforcement.

this site has been shaky on cub since the start for reasons i can't understand. i think the main 'argument' if i recall was "well the models might be trained on real CP" which is a dumb argument for several reasons because one nobody would do that and two this site allows very graphically realistic depictions of ferals, which easily could also be trained on real animals. realistically any model could be trained on illegal or immoral content and you'd have no way of knowing it, it's just that cub is the most blaringly alarming to most people despite, imho, the potential bestiality imagery involved with feral models being equally unjustifiable.

anyway, if you want young or cub ai art then inkbunny has you covered, no need to waste time trying to change the minds of e6 admins because they are notoriously... well, you know.

ieiji said:
this site has been shaky on cub since the start for reasons i can't understand. i think the main 'argument' if i recall was "well the models might be trained on real CP" which is a dumb argument for several reasons because one nobody would do that and two this site allows very graphically realistic depictions of ferals, which easily could also be trained on real animals. realistically any model could be trained on illegal or immoral content and you'd have no way of knowing it, it's just that cub is the most blaringly alarming to most people despite, imho, the potential bestiality imagery involved with feral models being equally unjustifiable.

anyway, if you want young or cub ai art then inkbunny has you covered, no need to waste time trying to change the minds of e6 admins because they are notoriously... well, you know.

I also looked for alternatives, because they even delete "innocent" nude depictions of petite or teenage women here, if they don't have massive breasts. The problem with inkbunny is that you *have* to meticulously write an exact manual how to reproduce every gen you post, down to the last detail. That's not really AI friendly, no matter what they say.

Rule34 allows *all* furry art without exception, because, as they state in their FAQ, there is no law that outlaws any of it, since furries are not technically humans, not even depictions of them. They don't have any restrictions or special rules for AI gens either. But, of course, Rule34 is not a dedicated furry site, unfortunately. It's a bit ironic that they stick to the law there, while here, on a dedicated furry site, they ban legal furry art...

The site owners here are waiting for some kind of court order concerning AI and CP. I don't think they themselves know what kind of precedence they are waiting for, because, again, furry art is never illegal, nor is hosting it. Their fears seem rather diffuse and their fascination with AI art rudimentary at best. The frequency of new forum posts here is below one per day and they still don't seem to bother ever reading or responding to any of it.

And, from a moral perspective, like I wrote in this thread: https://e6ai.net/forum_topics/124
"both "good" and "bad" (trained on abusive/illegal data) models can produce both young and adult furries, so by banning young furries (which apparently includes young adults now as well), you don't ensure in any way that the models used were good ones. There is so much "young" furry training data on e621 already, and it's been used in training all the furry models on civitAI - the ones that everyone here uses. Why would anyone, in this of all places, need any abusive/illegal real-life models? It doesn't make any sense. It's a frickin furry site..."

Since InkBunny was mentioned, just thought I'd chime in to say that Weasyl is another option. IB and Weasyl are the only 2 porn-friendly platforms that allow AI, but weasyl doesn't have all those silly nonsense rules. Not to mention being fine with human x non-human art.