Topic: Upload Guidelines and Standards

Posted under General

KifuUsaki

Member

I'm really confused. Artistic pictures with minor, I say near microscopic faults, are deleted. Yet non-artistic, unoriginal and even grotesque pictures, are approved without any issue.

I would like to suggest, and request, an evaluation of the standards for uploading. Shouldn't shocking or grotesque images be rejected?

mlem

Moderator

Feel free to flag any image you think violates our guidelines. At the very least I suggest you blacklist the tags / directors you don't want to see. We have a large userbase with very different tastes, so something you might see as shocking and grotesque can be perfectly fine for someone else. That's why the blacklist is a great tool to utilize.

I'm assuming you're referring to your own images getting deleted, but feel free to correct me and provide examples if that's not the case.

  • "loincloth merges with fur/body"
  • "artifacted eyes need inpainting"
  • "hand on right is missing fingernails"
  • "attempted signature"
  • "hand on left has six fingers"

These are all examples of reasons for why your images have been taken down, and I'd argue that none of them are near microscopic errors. They are however incredibly easy to fix with some basic inpainting, a tool I very much recommend you look into. There's a good starter guide on how to do it with Krita on our Discord server and an assortment of incredibly helpful users willing to guide you aswell - I swear I'm not only a little biased!

sergalbutt

Janitor

kifuusaki said:
I'm really confused. Artistic pictures with minor, I say near microscopic faults, are deleted. Yet non-artistic, unoriginal and even grotesque pictures, are approved without any issue.

I would like to suggest, and request, an evaluation of the standards for uploading. Shouldn't shocking or grotesque images be rejected?

The short answer is "no".
The slightly longer answer is:
No, because it's still considered "art". The site has a blacklist feature for the very reason of helping to prevent users from not seeing what they don't want to see.

KifuUsaki

Member

mlem said:
Feel free to flag any image you think violates our guidelines. At the very least I suggest you blacklist the tags / directors you don't want to see. We have a large userbase with very different tastes, so something you might see as shocking and grotesque can be perfectly fine for someone else. That's why the blacklist is a great tool to utilize.

I'm assuming you're referring to your own images getting deleted, but feel free to correct me and provide examples if that's not the case.

  • "loincloth merges with fur/body"
  • "artifacted eyes need inpainting"
  • "hand on right is missing fingernails"
  • "attempted signature"
  • "hand on left has six fingers"

These are all examples of reasons for why your images have been taken down, and I'd argue that none of them are near microscopic errors. They are however incredibly easy to fix with some basic inpainting, a tool I very much recommend you look into. There's a good starter guide on how to do it with Krita on our Discord server and an assortment of incredibly helpful users willing to guide you aswell - I swear I'm not only a little biased!

Not just my stuff, but if you look at it from my side... "Artifacted eyes." You mean light glare? Common in physical art renderings? And then... stuff that is shared, having zero artistic value... makes it through totally fine. If I may say so, it does feel insulting.

Now, I'm all for having fair rules applied equally across the board. And it does seem the rules are indeed being applied evenly, I'm not disputing that at all.

But it appears to me, and this is more... objective, I think... That the non-artistic pictures, the anatomically hyper-focused, or exaggerated images... ("Hey, AI, draw me (character) with BOOBS!") And the shockingly grotesque ones... have so little to them that it's nigh impossible for it to have such issues. But yet, more detailed pictures seem to be held to a higher standard because it's easy for a near-photo to have minor errors.

(I should point out, eye artifacting, and hand on left has six fingers, both those were so incredibly minor. That second one, was, shadow, or pawpad, or a wider claw... As you are a moderator, I invite you to look at the original, and if you can, tell me if that's easy to miss.)

KifuUsaki

Member

sergalbutt said:
The short answer is "no".
The slightly longer answer is:
No, because it's still considered "art". The site has a blacklist feature for the very reason of helping to prevent users from not seeing what they don't want to see.

I guess that comes back to... Define Art. Real art galleries are filled with "art" that has people questioning if it's artistic in any way. For example, a glove dropped on a floor by mistake became an exhibit. An "artful smudged mirror" was accidentally washed by a confused custodian who didn't realize it was supposed to be art. True enough, art to one is not art to another.

But I do wonder if there is room for content guidelines.

However, you said no to that... If there is ever room for further discussion, I'd love to be a part of that conversation. I just grow tired of adding new things to my blacklist, almost every time I look at the front page... (That's assuming people even tag their stuff fully and correctly. Blacklisting requires that a post I don't want to see, contains the tag...)

Updated

sergalbutt

Janitor

kifuusaki said:
Define Art.
[...]
True enough, art to one is not art to another.

You said it.

kifuusaki said:
But I do wonder if there is room for content guidelines.

And as per your previous statement, it's not our place to judge the content. We might not like it, but it doesn't change the fact.

kifuusaki said:
That's assuming people even tag their stuff fully and correctly. Blacklisting requires that a post I don't want to see, contains the tag...)

And that's a fair assessment. The blacklist does rely that people tag correctly, especially in terms of "extreme" content. However, uploaders who don't tag properly often get warned (and we encourage people to report such users), and repeat offenders have lost their uploading privileges because of it.

mlem

Moderator

kifuusaki said:
Not just my stuff, but if you look at it from my side... "Artifacted eyes." You mean light glare? Common in physical art renderings? And then... stuff that is shared, having zero artistic value... makes it through totally fine. If I may say so, it does feel insulting.

The "light glare" makes about as much sense as the two randomly placed showerheads do. Eye on the right has light glare, but the other one is just typical AI jank. You even went on to fix it.

kifuusaki said:
I should point out, eye artifacting, and hand on left has six fingers, both those were so incredibly minor. That second one, was, shadow, or pawpad, or a wider claw... As you are a moderator, I invite you to look at the original, and if you can, tell me if that's easy to miss.

I can see where the staff member is coming from, but again it's such an incredibly easy fix, that you could've corrected it about five times with the time you spent writing your post. There's also the weird deformed claw on the thumb of the same hand, which wasn't highlighted but would be a good reason to remove the image aswell. Here's the other thumb just to compare the two.

FlowerSylveon

Privileged

mlem said:
The "light glare" makes about as much sense as the two randomly placed showerheads do

not random
one from the back and one from the front obviously
AI so smart to come up with solutions for us
(i'm in a joking tone but there are actual bathrooms with that set up for that reason)

KifuUsaki

Member

mlem said:

but again it's such an incredibly easy fix, that you could've corrected it about five times with the time you spent writing your post.

You're making this all about my stuff... Yes, there were a few small faults. But yes, I did check, and I thought they'd be accepted. Especially given the other content I've seen approved, of less-good quality.

Moving on,

Point being, high-quality style images are prone to minor issues more easily than toon style. But further, it's not fun trying to jump through so many hoops, and also seeing such "slop" be approved without a problem. Sure, one man's trash is another man's art.

But rather than telling me that my mistakes are my fault, can we discuss the idea of whether terrible content is art or just... Bad?

mlem

Moderator

I’m focusing on your stuff because you haven’t given us anything else to work with, except saying “bad stuff is bad.” I think it’s ironic that you’re referring to other people’s posts as “slop,” when that’s the one word I’d use to describe your posts.

Again, if you feel like any posts are violating our guidelines, you’re more than welcome to flag them. But it’s hard for me to take your comment as anything but petty nonsense when you refuse to give us any sort of examples and instead resort to vague whataboutism.

KalethOrebiter

Privileged

kifuusaki said:
it's not fun trying to jump through so many hoops, and also seeing such "slop" be approved without a problem. Sure, one man's trash is another man's art.

But rather than telling me that my mistakes are my fault, can we discuss the idea of whether terrible content is art or just... Bad?

The misconception here is that staff judge the quality of the posts on their feelings about the post: They don't.

The slop the staff is vetting against is mostly AI generation defects. That means the "terrible content" you refer too (assuming you're arguing in good fate and have examples) have little to no defects as defined in the uploading guidelines — Exception being post that have slipped through the cracks, in which case you should flag them.

Delken

Member

kifuusaki said:
can we discuss the idea of whether terrible content is art or just... Bad?

Your whole point is "me no likey image because the content is gross and icky, therefore it should be deleted"

If only something called a blacklist existed eh. And given the extreme quality standard you might have, I think you'd be better off blacklisting every single tag except for "realistic" and "pinup" lmao